wednes: (Default)
wednes ([personal profile] wednes) wrote2005-12-23 12:19 am
Entry tags:

Holiday, Political, and Religious Musings:

I've had a fairly ordinary couple of days. My holiday shopping is done, I even have a Christmas dinner planned since H will be here for once. I forgot that he takes the actual day Christmas more seriously than I; so I'm going to make sure to recognize his day. We're having chicken parmesan.

I didn't do anything special for the Longest Night of the Year. I wrote, went online, talked to some people, had dinner, and watched TV. No big whoop.

It makes me angry whenever I pay attention to the news, so I don't. I haven't noticed that the Patriot Act has been extended for no good reason. I'm trying to let go of my disgust for Bush's absurd and blatantly self-serving pandering. He makes me physically sick to watch anymore. I weep for the country I love. Although, I admit, I have to laugh (again) at the utter ridiculousness of Rick Santorum. Everyone involved in this particular bit of news is so ridiculous, I don't even know where to begin the pointing and laughing.


I know this is a silly seeming topic. Most people I know think it shouldn't be anywhere near a public school; while there are one or two who honestly think they are being discriminated against because thier religious beleifs are not being taught as fact in government funded schools.

I daresay that whether or not "intelligent design" is okay to teach in shcool depends on what subject it is. It would be appropriate for say, a comparative religions class that covers many major theories on how the earth was created. Greeks, Romans, Native Americans also have fascinating creation stories that kids would probably be damn interested in. And learning that different cultures believe different things is important for kids to know. So I totally support teaching basic Christian tenants so long as other faiths are also represented in a respectful, intelligent way. Of course, that's a pretty tall order. Teachers are people, and as we all know, a good percentage of people has great difficulty separating fact from feeling.

However, teaching "intelligent design" in say, a science class is outright absurd. Science is about facts: provable, hard evidence that you can see and hear and touch. That's what science is. And I don't understand how any logical person can miss the difference between science and religion. Faith is a wonderful and important thing, but it's not the same as universal fact.

Then again, I still haven't figured out how some people still cannot accept that not everyone practices the same religion as them...and that that is not illegal, immoral, or wrong.

Could you imagine what would happen if pagans behaved that way? What if we said we were being discriminated against because there was no giant phallus or flaming pentacle in front of city hall? What if we sued a public school because they didn't teach students about Athena, Dionysus, or the divine union of male and female in science class? We'd be laughed out of the city, even a liberal city like Ann Arbor.


I've also been reading a lot of posts from people who "hate Christmas". To them I say, if you hate it so much, why are you paying so much attention to it? Seriously, stores are only slightly more garish and crowded. People are arguing about petty crap and stressing out only a tad more than they usually do. Yeah, that music they play sucks, but (ipods are plentiful and) you don't really have to listen to it.



Problem: I hate my family and dread seeing them.
Solution: Volunteer at a soup kitchen or shelter. Visit a retirement home or hospital.

Problem: I don't know what to buy for my family/friends.
Solution: Donate to charity in their names.

Problem: I can't afford nice gifts.
Solution: Baked goods, a photo in a frame, anything handmade, or time well spent are all things people will treasure.

Problem: Winter Weather in Michigan sucks.
Solution: Well, if your house and all your belongings weren't detroyed by the weather, you're doing better than some.

And for gosh sakes, if you still haven't come out to your families, the big, family, holiday dinner is NOT the right time!!!

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[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 05:21 am (UTC)(link)
I'm not sure I understand the connection.
itches: (Default)

[personal profile] itches 2005-12-23 05:26 am (UTC)(link)
They're all 'bad' words. Which sums up my imediate reaction fairly well.
itches: (itches)

[personal profile] itches 2005-12-23 05:29 am (UTC)(link)
Not to say that there can't be a place for it in Schools, but it isn't a scientific theory so it doesn't belong in science classes. People arguing it seem to not understand why science deals with theories instead of facts.

I went to Catholic schools and I attended religion classes all throughout it, but they did these classes well. While we did look at Christianity, we also spent a lot of time examining other religions and other issues like morality and ethics.


[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 05:33 am (UTC)(link)
Yeah, that's pretty much my stance as well. I think kids should definately be exposed to various religions. So if ID is being taught in say, social studies along with other religious creationism theories it's okay. But if it's being taught as scientific fact, it's right out.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 05:32 am (UTC)(link)
Ha. Okay then.
itches: (Angel Guy)

[personal profile] itches 2005-12-23 05:34 am (UTC)(link)
Also about Christmas. I'm totally offended by people who want to replace it with 'winter solstice' as it's insensitive to me and my situation. I'm in the Southern Hemisphere, it is summer here!

And this just to be clear about my meaning.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 06:03 am (UTC)(link)
LOL

I hear ya.

[identity profile] brokenbuzz.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 12:39 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm sorry, but as someone who posted what you might have referred to as an "I Hate Christmas" post, I have to reply.

Slightly more garish and crowded? A tad more? Are you completely lying to yourself so you can continue to get down with Christmas even though you're a pagan and have no real reason to do so?

I think the onslaught of Christmasanity isn't slapping us all in the face from stores or anything like that. It's in public buildings, television and radio commercials, decorations at my favorite deli . . . I'm only saying to suggest we not pay so much attention is frankly naive. If it were possible, I'd not pay attention to it. But that's like asking someone not to pay attention to a flaming phallus (or whatever) jiggling around in his face.

And when you've grown up without Christmas, and plan to go on without it, at some point when you're around thirteen or so, it begins to get more than annoying. Hence, "I Hate Christmas."

I probably shouldn't reply to stangers when I haven't slept much.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 01:37 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't want to get into an argument. But [livejournal.com profile] wednes is right. No one forces anyone to celebrate Christmas. And the stores aren't that crowded. I did all my christmas shopping in 2 days last week, and the entire experience was pleasant.

It's your own fault that you can't tune it out. Don't blame christmas for your inadequacies.

Oh and by the way, Christmas and I were chatting the other day, Christmas hates you too. So it's all good.

[identity profile] brokenbuzz.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 02:07 pm (UTC)(link)
Okay, when did I say someone forced me to celebrate Christmas? Oh wait, I didn't. Because I don't celebrate Christmas, you moron.

Man, why did you feel the need to get all rude about it? My point was that Christmas is everywhere, big abd brassy and bold, especially in the city, and it's impossible to ignore.

And yeah, I know Christmas hates me. News flash: it hated me long before I hated it.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 02:46 pm (UTC)(link)
No one said you were forced to celebrate Christmas. Now who's being rude?

It isn't impossible to ignore. You are just unable to do it. And that's not Christmas' fault.

[identity profile] brokenbuzz.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 02:56 pm (UTC)(link)
Well, you implied it when you said "No one forces anyone to celebrate Christmas."

And yes, it is impossible to ignore. Come work 8 to 9 hours per day in Rockefeller Center and tell me you can ignore the Christmasness here.

Oh, and I'm totally allowed to be rude back to rudeness.

[identity profile] ruthlessbabe.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 03:11 pm (UTC)(link)
It might be impossible to ignore, but it's not that hard to respectfully not give a damn.

[identity profile] brokenbuzz.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 03:20 pm (UTC)(link)
It seems to get harder every year, I'm sorry to say. I admit that's my issue.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 10:04 pm (UTC)(link)
Damn, dude. Harsh!

I always welcome an alternative viewpoint; even though hatred of Christmas is probably too pervasive to be called "alternative".

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-12-25 03:55 am (UTC)(link)
Well it's over in my journal now.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 10:01 pm (UTC)(link)
You make some valid points here. And my post is meant to be taken tongue-in-cheek. But since you dont' know me, you have no way of knowing that; so it's cool.

My family has always celebrated Christmas in a secular way. So Christmas to me is a time to get together and break bread with loved ones; it has nothing to do with the birth of Jesus. But I also think Jesus was a good guy; he's not about hate and judgmentalism like so many of his so-called followrs. But that may be a subject for another time.

The main point of this wasn't to chastiz people for not feeling as I do. It was to suggest that hating something only adds to the quotient of hate. But looking past what annoys you into what's actually good about something can add to the amount of joy in the world. While that may seem absurdly simple; you'd be amazed how much good it can do.
groovesinorbit: (Default)

[personal profile] groovesinorbit 2005-12-23 01:50 pm (UTC)(link)
The article on Rick (I can't stand to type it) Santorum was my first giggle of the day. Thanks! What a hypocritical schmuck.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 10:06 pm (UTC)(link)
Yup.

His whole deal is offensive; but even if you're a total ass you should stand by your bullshit.

church of the flying spaghetti monster

[identity profile] sleazeanna.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 04:50 pm (UTC)(link)
have you seen venganza.org?

Re: church of the flying spaghetti monster

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 10:12 pm (UTC)(link)
I have indeed.

Good stuff. I have no problem with that being taught in schools. In fact, I think all kids should be encouraged to make up their own creation theory.

[identity profile] kindofblue328.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 07:34 pm (UTC)(link)
Wednes, you know I'm a Christian, with that said, I say this:

I am a Christian who is against any intermingling of church and state, I think it makes for bad religion and bad state. If Christians want their kids to learn intelligent design...teach them at home, sunday school, or private school. The reason why evolution should taught in public schools is because thats whats widely accepted by most, one day that may change to a new theory. Also, there are a gozillion different creation stories and it would be wrong to say the Christian one is the best one, at least in a public school setting. I am also sick of those Christians who think that you are not Christian if you believe in evolution, because there are many Christian evolutionists.

Anyway, separation of Church and State is where I stand, and I am a Christian, period!

[identity profile] kindofblue328.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 07:38 pm (UTC)(link)
I also agree with the idea that it isnt for science class because its not science...that is brilliant. They should teach it in a world religions course.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 07:53 pm (UTC)(link)
That's been my take on creationism vs. evolution from the beginning. It doesn't need to be a constitutional issue. It's a curriculum issue. Religion should not be influencing scientific education.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-12-23 11:09 pm (UTC)(link)
I have found that many, if not most Christians have what I consider a reasonable stance on this issue. I have also found that the loudest and most vocal tend to be the most radical and dogmatic of fundie Christians.

H and his family are Christian, and they are a joy to know.

[identity profile] lickingtoad.livejournal.com 2005-12-26 03:21 am (UTC)(link)
MY DAD, to ME, after seperating one greyhound from another with one of those plastic child-gates across the den: "Are you going to come out?"

ME: "I thought I already had!"