wednes: (Default)
wednes ([personal profile] wednes) wrote2005-04-19 04:04 pm
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One more job I'm out of the running for: or Even Ned Flanders would dislike this guy:

Crochety old man made new Pontiff. Promises more of the same...but not as fun. Pope Benedict XVI, it seems, has had it up to here *indicates mitre* with the liberalism and acceptance of other cultures propagated in contemporary society.

He's sick and tired of women working outside the home (in trousers, no less), people having sex and forming families with those they love (unless of course their union is bathed in the loving light of Christ--who never did take a wife, BTW), and people seeking deity in ways unsanctioned by him and his friends from work. Sounds like he's going to begin his new gig by condemning a whoooooole lot of people. Should be just the image builder the church has needed since everyone found out they passively sanctioned the rape and molestation of hundreds of children.

Seriously, this guy is going to set them back 100 years.
And for the Catholic Church, that means the 1700's.

I hear people saying "well, he's 78...he won't be around too long". But it's not like this guy's going to be doing any manual labor. Those poor Catholics could be in for 20+ years of ultra conservative diddley.

Think I'll pop some corn, pull up a comfy chair and just watch people flock away from The Church.


I was not raised in the church. My mom decided when I was in 7th grade that the neighborhood schools were not good, so we were going to Catholic school. Since it was less expensive for parish members, we all had to get baptized and attend church. Myself, I was totaly welcoming and "into it". The idea that a big guy in the sky had a grand plan for us seemed very inviting. And the whole "infinite light of god" dealie sounded very nice to a disturbed, depressed little punk such as myself.

The next year, was Confirmation Year. Confirmation is when you take the oaths that your godparent takes for you at baptism. You confirm that you will be a Catholic for the rest of your life. But here's the thing...you're 13 years old. Tell me any other lasting choice a 13 year old is allowed to make for themself? There is none...because 13 year olds don't know enough about themselves, the world and the choices that will face them in the future to make any such choice. We were told to get confirmed, so we did. There was no choice about it. I could go on and on about how disengenuous this all felt to me at the time, but I won't. My biggest problem with Christian churches in general is the indoctrination of children before they have gotten a chance to figure things out for themselves. Apparently the adage: if you love something, set it free and it will return to you, doesn't apply to God.

You all know how it ends...I found a path that doesn't require me to shun anyone based on who they love or how they worship, a path that understands that there is more to morality than sex, and a path that asserts we should not hate ourselves for the things we think, and that we should care for the earth so it will care for us. (I've always kind of felt that the official christian stance on the earth is similar to your spoiled cousin who gets all the expensive birthday gifts: "it's mine, I'll do what I want with it!" as he flies his remote control airplane into Aunt Millies barbeque pit because he can.) It's been nice.

[identity profile] madush69.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 08:57 pm (UTC)(link)
I did not like Catholic school. I remember confirmation, but just going through the motions. You are so right about them confirming people too young. Joe has asked me about God. I said I think there may be one, but I'm not sure. A lot of things happen in the world that make me wonder. one of the things the nuns used to hate me for was when I'd ask questions they had no good answer for. (I went to public school from k-4)
I asked a nun something regarding Vatican 2, and how a lot of things changed from one pope to the next. She said that one pope had made changes from what some previous one had been doing. I then asked her why he would do that if all popes are (as they said) infallible. She had no good answer and moved along to the next kid.

Electric Boogaloo?

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 10:43 pm (UTC)(link)
Vatican 2?

I didn't realize there was a sequel.

Re: Electric Boogaloo?

[identity profile] madush69.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 02:26 pm (UTC)(link)
The Second Vatican Council was summoned by Pope John XXIII, convening in four sessions each year from 1962 to 1965. It was his desire that the Church be brought up to date and adapt itself to meet the challenging conditions of modern times. Generally, Vatican II was an overhaul of the way the Church conducted itself and celebrated the liturgy, so that she would be more accessible to the people. Therefore, the subject was not just any given element of the Church, but rather the entire Church, period. This was no small undertaking, and by the time it was over, it spawned four Constitutions, nine Decrees, and three Declarations. The Council was closed on December 8th, 1965 by Pope Paul VI, who had guided the council through it’s final three sessions.

Re: Electric Boogaloo?

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 10:15 pm (UTC)(link)
Wow...nice cut and paste.

Is that when they stopped doing mass in Latin?

[identity profile] psychswitch.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:03 pm (UTC)(link)
Dogs and cats living together....MASS HYSTERIA!

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:11 pm (UTC)(link)
Hahahahahaa!

[identity profile] cmdavi-70.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:09 pm (UTC)(link)
I had predicted that they would play the multicultural card and still manage to take the church back 100 years. I shouldn't have given them that much credit. It's pontiff Strom Thurmond all the way.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:13 pm (UTC)(link)
He's offended by women who wear PANTS for crying out loud.

[identity profile] cmdavi-70.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:28 pm (UTC)(link)
Never mind that he's a man in lace and frills.

[identity profile] madush69.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:36 pm (UTC)(link)
Maybe he's a leg-man.

[identity profile] sudrin.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 10:38 pm (UTC)(link)
Gary and I knew a girl at Beecher who NEVER wore pants. Kelly Kolaski I think was her name. Of course, it didn't help I had a crush on her and Gary enjoyed teasing me about her. As far as I know to this day she still doesn't wear pants. She also never cut her hair, but I don't know if that was part of it or not.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 10:41 pm (UTC)(link)
I think it is. though I can't place it, it seems that I remember hearing about a fundie faith that proscribes against women cutting thier hair. There is a biblical prohibition regarding it...some troll was just bothering me about it.

I got a troll email comment to a post I made 2 years ago. it actually sounded similar to a troll I dealt with...well, about 2 years ago who apparently went to Olivet with me. He was too cowardly to identify himself as such people often are, but it was pretty damn funny just the same.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 12:29 am (UTC)(link)
The other front runner for Pontiff was a Nigerian guy.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 12:47 pm (UTC)(link)
It doesn't matter who the other front runner was. In fact, can you seriously believe that the black dude even had a chance? Saying they might elect a black pope doesn't make it multicultural. Jessie Jackson can run for president, but that doesn't make the presidential race a multicultural event.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 09:51 pm (UTC)(link)
What Dave actually said was "I had predicted that they would play the multicultural card and still manage to take the church back 100 years. I shouldn't have given them that much credit."

Meanning, I had predicted they would have elected the Nigerian fellow, even though that probably would have meant more of the same. Of course in retrospect, I should have known they wouldn't elect a black man.

Which is essentially what you've said, only in a needlessly confrontational and contrary manner.

I know as a pagan, popedom is very important to you, but I'd appreciate it if you could try to play nice in my journal.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-04-21 12:32 pm (UTC)(link)
No that's not what I said. My point is that they didn't play the multicultural card at all. They did the same shazbot that they always do.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-21 03:50 pm (UTC)(link)
But one of the front runners was a black guy from Nigeria. Black counts as multi-cultural now.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-04-22 02:12 am (UTC)(link)
How can there be a front runner in a contest where the candidates are not allowed to campaign? The media stirred up the multicultural card. The Catholic Church did not. Do you honestly believe that they were torn between the former Nazi youth, and the black guy? It took 2 days to decide, I don't think it was a tough decision.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-22 02:30 am (UTC)(link)
Well gee, if they're not allowed to campaign, then I'm sure they're not. Because no one ever does anything they aren't supposed to do.

Why do you have to take such umbridge at the assertion that they could have chosen a black guy and didn't?

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-04-24 04:36 pm (UTC)(link)
"Why do you have to take such umbridge at the assertion that they could have chosen a black guy and didn't?"
Because instead they chose a Nazi.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-24 09:52 pm (UTC)(link)
The vatican choosing a Nazi has nothing to do with the way you talk to Dave.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-04-25 12:27 pm (UTC)(link)
If you please re-read the thread you will see that I was not in any way rude. I asked a simple question.

Dave: "I had predicted that they would play the multicultural card and still manage to take the church back 100 years."
Nate: "How is it multicultural?"

I guess the next time someone makes a statement that I don't understand, I'll just keep my keyboard to myself.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-25 04:17 pm (UTC)(link)
I found your next 3 comments after that to be needlessly confrontational...but upon rereading I can concede that I may be reading too much into your exclamation points.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-04-25 04:47 pm (UTC)(link)
And that they were directed at you, not at dave.

[identity profile] cmdavi-70.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 01:16 am (UTC)(link)
If they had chosen the African candidate, they could have said, "See, we're not the back-asswards folks you progressives say we are," and yet, that pope's policy's would have likely rivaled the selected pope in extreme conservatism. But, I realize it's a cynical view that assumes the choices made in the Vatican are that purely politically-motivated, and I could be totally worng-headed for suggesting this. I most definitely wasn't suggesting their actual choice was a multicultural one.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 12:47 pm (UTC)(link)
But they didn't do that.

[identity profile] anarchys-savior.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:10 pm (UTC)(link)
Haha, I love you. XD

If he dies within the next few years (before 2012) and a new Pope gets elected, then converts, it will be the END OF THE WORLD!!! Or not.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:13 pm (UTC)(link)
I guess we'll just have to keep our fingers crossed.

[identity profile] purplecat-a2.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:13 pm (UTC)(link)
According to Dan Brown ("The Da Vinci Code") Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:14 pm (UTC)(link)
That's a fictional book, even though I suppose Scorsese asserts the same possibility.

[identity profile] purplecat-a2.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:21 pm (UTC)(link)
But it's based on scholarly research, and gnostic texts.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 09:38 pm (UTC)(link)
I am told that there are many glaring errors. Folks at [livejournal.com profile] pagan had a right little fit at the assertion that the book is factual.

To be honest, I haven't read it yet but I assumed it was fiction based loosely on historical assertions. Like urban legends, the best stories have some shreds of beleivability in them.

[identity profile] anarchys-savior.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 10:01 pm (UTC)(link)
There's not a whole lot the folks at [livejournal.com profile] pagan don't throw a small fit about.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 10:22 pm (UTC)(link)
Ha.

True dat. I finally left that comm, feeling frustrated over the same kinds of posts over and over, plus all the damn trolls wasting my time. I sometimes forget that the internet is just a microcosm of the world, and I don't actually like people very much.

[identity profile] zenithberwyn.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 11:03 pm (UTC)(link)
It's based on some gnostic texts (which may or may not be historically accurate), some accurate scholarly research, and some scholarly research whose conjectures have been called into question rather pointedly. It makes for a much more interesting story, though.

[identity profile] sweinberg.livejournal.com 2005-04-19 11:11 pm (UTC)(link)
Seriously, this guy is going to set them back 100 years.
And for the Catholic Church, that means the 1700's.

---Made me chuckle. ;)

[identity profile] deathscythe81.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 12:12 am (UTC)(link)
Is it just me or do you find it a tad funny as well that this guy looks a lot like the last pope?

[identity profile] madush69.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 02:29 pm (UTC)(link)
I think he looks like a mix between Jack Palance and Emperor Palpatine from Star Wars.

[identity profile] nate101000.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 12:28 am (UTC)(link)
Ditto to the whole thing about confirmation.

You don't have to be christian to feel that way about the earth.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 12:32 am (UTC)(link)
Of course not, but many christians assert that God gave the earth to man to hold dominion over and it is therefore gods will that man be in charge.

In fact, H subscribes to this philosophy. But because he is not a power-hungry lunatic, he realizes that holding dominion and being a tyrant are not nessesarily the same thing. Benevolence will take one much further than tryanny.

[identity profile] everythingtold.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 02:38 am (UTC)(link)
I was soooo about to make a similar post. Seriously.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 04:08 am (UTC)(link)
Right On!

A lot of people are posting about the Pontiff today. I do it because I love to mouth-off about things, and also for timliness.
itches: (Default)

[personal profile] itches 2005-04-20 07:57 am (UTC)(link)
Your level of research amazes me.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 08:12 am (UTC)(link)
Ya think? I pretty much only do research online. Other than that, I just pay attention to stuff I deem important. Sometimes that's the Pontiff, sometimes, it's peanut butter cups.

[identity profile] orangepaisley.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 01:15 pm (UTC)(link)
"Pontiff or Peanut Butter?"

Even if nobody understood what it was about, that would make a great non sequitur bumper sticker!

[identity profile] madush69.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 02:31 pm (UTC)(link)
Mmm, Pontiff Butter Cups! It's a new Catholic marketing scheme!

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2005-04-20 10:11 pm (UTC)(link)
I concur!