wednes: (Default)
wednes ([personal profile] wednes) wrote2007-12-29 10:20 am
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How on earth is that the Tiger's fault?!?

I'm sure by now we've all heard about the Siberian Tiger attack at the San Francisco zoo.
No?
Well, read up.
It's really very sad that the police killed the tiger. I'm not really clear on why they didn't merely trank it, I guess because that can take a few minutes and the tiger was already escaped. I just don't see why the tiger had to pay for the mistakes of humans. It's also very sad that a 17 year old kid was killed. I mean, damn.

My favorite zoo is the Detroit Zoo, mainly because that's the one I grew up with. I can remember looking at the lion enclosure, thinking that a male lion could certainly jump that puny moat if he wanted to. I also wondered if the animals weren't drugged or something to make them easy to handle. That was a rumor at the zoo for a while, that the animals were drugged.

I'm pretty torn on zoos to begin with. Of course it's not right or natural to keep animals locked up in pens for our amusement. At the same time, I really love seeing the grizzlies and lions and other "dangerous" animals I'd never see in real life. Zoos today do a much better job of keeping, especially big animals, in habitats close to what they are used to. I still haven't seen the new polar bear exhibit, but I hear it kicks ass. Somebody should take me there.

Usually when a person is attacked by a wild animal, it's because the person was doing something really stupid, like leaning against the bars or climbing over the fence. This time, the tiger actually escaped and mauled three people, killing one. Apparently this tiger had also attacked a zoo keeper during a public feeding. Zoo keepers seem to live in perpetual peril.

I can recall when the Detroit Zoo stopped keeping elephants (who, incidentally, kill roughly one zookeeper a year in the US) because they were too difficult to keep healthy. Because they are social animals, they became very unhappy in captivity, and would run into trees, smashing them with their big elephant heads. Very sad. I love zoos, but I have to wonder how much longer we will have them at all...

[identity profile] squamous.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 03:56 pm (UTC)(link)
All in all I am anti zoo, but with some conflicted feelings about it for sure... it's really amazing to be able to see animals with your own eyes, animals I might never otherwise get a chance to see safely. I had one experience at the Denver Zoo years ago that kind of summed it up for me. They had a black jaguar that was just awe inspiring to behold, but that was pacing back and forth seemingly neurotically in its pen. I found myself desperately wanting to help it escape, although I never would have since how would you get it back to 'the wild' and even if you could, could it still survive?

On the zoo apologist side I've read claims that some animals would naturally stick to a small range and being confined in a zoo doesn't bother them, and that zoos are preserving animals whose natural habitats are being wrecked. I'm sure there are better arguments someone who has studied up on it could make. It still feels cruel to lock up something like a big cat. Although I bet most zookeepers love animals.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 04:03 pm (UTC)(link)
Although I bet most zookeepers love animals.



Yeah, I'll bet that too. I always think of the old time circuses where the animals were in cages just big enough for them to stand and turn around in. At least THAT doesn't happen anymore.

Big cats pacing is not a good sign. I saw a Tiger doing that at the national zoo once, it was very upsetting.
itches: (Default)

[personal profile] itches 2007-12-29 04:18 pm (UTC)(link)
'Usually when a person is attacked by a wild animal, it's because the person was doing something really stupid'

DO NOT POKE THE BEAR!

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 04:29 pm (UTC)(link)
Totally.

[identity profile] darkeryet.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 04:33 pm (UTC)(link)
Zoos make me fucking sad so I don't go anymore. Gotta go on a safari if I want to see lions and such again. *sniff*

[identity profile] locakitty.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 04:46 pm (UTC)(link)
West Palm Beach had the best zoo EVAR. It was a drive through type thing. Keep your windows up because you are hanging out right next to a freaking lion.

The lions were in their own fenced in area, maybe an acre or so. There were two lionkeepers or whatever in trucks on opposite sides of the area to make sure some asshole didn't get out of his car to take a better picture or something.

They had elephants that had a whole bunch of open space, they were pretty groovy. The monkeys had their own island. So sweet.

Then they had gazelle, emu, weird deer things...it was so great. And just all this room for the animals to run around. No cages, no "natural habitats", just wide open space.

Of course, we almost got charged by a rhino. That kind of sucked. Especially when you are in a car that is smaller than the rhino. :)

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 04:53 pm (UTC)(link)
Safari?

Now there's an idea.
itches: (Default)

[personal profile] itches 2007-12-29 04:54 pm (UTC)(link)
Great, now I need to work out a way to draw a stick-figure bear.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 04:55 pm (UTC)(link)
A rhino? Holy shit that must have been terrifying.

I've always wanted to go to one of those drive thru zoos. That sounds awesome.

...and a bear

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 04:56 pm (UTC)(link)
LOL

I look forward to that.

[identity profile] boblovesdot.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 05:17 pm (UTC)(link)
When they kill tigers or whatever after it's killed a human, they usually say they have to because it's gotten the taste for human blood. evidently, we're magically delicious.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 05:20 pm (UTC)(link)
Ew. Is that really true?
That's horrible if it is, but it sounds archaic to me.

[identity profile] madush69.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 05:48 pm (UTC)(link)
Humans taste of chicken.

[identity profile] the-hellcat.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 06:24 pm (UTC)(link)
I, too, am torn about zoos. But I am much more anti-circus.

Indianapolis has a rather nice zoo. The enclosures are quite large, particularly the elephant area. They have good luck with elephant births, too. There's about 1 every year or two. And there were two giraffe births this past year.
The only animals that I've ever noticed looking irritated are the cats. Well, the lionesses, particularly. I'm guessing they're longing for 'the thrill of the hunt'?

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 07:06 pm (UTC)(link)
I've never been to the Indianapolis Zoo, but I'd love to see some baby elephants and giraffes.
groovesinorbit: (willow and buffy)

[personal profile] groovesinorbit 2007-12-29 07:53 pm (UTC)(link)
I've been really sad about the tiger, too. And, if you read that one Chronicle article, it really looks like the whole thing was a mess. I heard on NPR, and don't know if this is true, the one of the guys who was attacked had been taunting the critter. Just stupid.

And yeah, mixed on zoos. It's cool to see the animals, and the better zoos have pretty good breeding programs that are helping endangered animals, but the idea of animals in captivity just makes me wince a little.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 08:03 pm (UTC)(link)
*nods* Yeah, I wish there was a way to know what the animals would prefer...

[identity profile] hellamama.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 08:05 pm (UTC)(link)
I am also emotionally torn about zoos. I love them, but they make me sad.

However, people are just stupid. They do not respect wild animals, and somehow believe that the animals are supposed to respect us. In national parks, people stop and get out of their cars and walk right up to big, wild animals that can seriously hurt them. Then they get upset if the animal charges.

At the Okefenokee Swamp tourist area, there are signs everywhere warning that these are real, live, wild alligators. They are not in cages and roam about at will. Now, an alligator will not attack a human on land unless it is provoked. Mostly they just lie there. But people actually walk up to them and POKE them. ALLIGATORS!

People suck. I'm mad about the tiger getting shot.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 08:29 pm (UTC)(link)
What kind of a fuckwit would poke an alligator?
I'm appalled.

[identity profile] the-hellcat.livejournal.com 2007-12-29 08:48 pm (UTC)(link)
The baby elephants get an elephant 'cake' made of their favorite foods on their birthdays! It's super fun.:)

[identity profile] hellamama.livejournal.com 2007-12-30 12:24 am (UTC)(link)
The people that poke the alligators always say, "I thought it was a fake one."
But really, why would you poke a fake alligator?

Fuckwit. Snort.
groovesinorbit: (roy batty)

[personal profile] groovesinorbit 2007-12-30 02:56 am (UTC)(link)
I imagine they would prefer that humans just go extinct and leave them the hell alone, and darned if we aren't trying to help them with that. *sigh*
Edited 2007-12-30 02:58 (UTC)

[identity profile] spiralwitch.livejournal.com 2007-12-30 04:56 am (UTC)(link)
The Toledo Zoo is much better than the Detroit one, only because at the Detroit Zoo, you have to walk for mmmmiiiiilllleeess just to see anything.

I am with you on the whole zoo thing. I guess, now that there are human habitats and laws and such, I don't feel so bad. But I remember some of the cages for the lions when I was little... I remember feeling so sad for them. Watching them walk back and forth like prisoners :(

[identity profile] spiralwitch.livejournal.com 2007-12-30 04:57 am (UTC)(link)
humane...not human. LOL.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-30 06:00 am (UTC)(link)
I did find that pretty funny.

;-]

shooting it

[identity profile] katharinakatt.livejournal.com 2007-12-30 04:38 pm (UTC)(link)
It seems it was police that shot it and not zoo officials. Which really is confusing because I would think that the zoo would have some kind of procedure and a group of keepers to call if a animal got loose. From the reports I've seen a zoo keeper called the police.

The tiger was still proceeding to attack people when the police got to it. There wasn't time to get tranquilizers, and its very possible more would be dead if they hadn't shot it.

Its sad, but I don't blame the cops, I blame the zoo procedures/staff.

Re: shooting it

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-30 05:02 pm (UTC)(link)
Yeah, the zoo is definitely at fault. I wouldn't expect police to do anything but shoot it. But you're right, there should have been a procedure in place to protect both the public and the animal.

Sad.

[identity profile] lickingtoad.livejournal.com 2007-12-31 02:34 am (UTC)(link)
My eldest-of-our-cousins Dan just got back from Africa. The pictures are /amazing./ I bet you'd have a blast.

How I spent my holiday vacation

[identity profile] felixbunay.livejournal.com 2007-12-31 02:55 am (UTC)(link)
Well, just because it happens to be 'on topic,' this is from my vacation, filmed on Thursday while I was being 'zookeeper for a day' at the Phoenix Zoo:

http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=24816071

I believe zoos are necessary. If you have no contact or interaction with something, you cannot learn to love it, or wish to protect it. And even Elephants need human protection - from other humans. This particular elephant was abused in a circus, and once killed a guy. Now she is well treated and cared for at the Phoenix Zoo...including attention to the abscesses on her foot, even if it is sometimes painful to have them treated.
Edited 2007-12-31 02:57 (UTC)

Re: How I spent my holiday vacation

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2007-12-31 04:02 am (UTC)(link)
Yeah, circuses seem like bad news for animals.

Thanks for the video clip, interesting stuff. Good point about zoos as well, that is where most of us learned to love animals.

[identity profile] bethie8888.livejournal.com 2008-01-04 03:01 am (UTC)(link)
My first thought exactly. Why'd they kill the tiger? In this age of tranq guns, etc., why not just stun it. Zoo officials should have been able to handle that. Not police.

[identity profile] wednes.livejournal.com 2008-01-04 03:27 am (UTC)(link)
*nods*
I'm not even sure why police were involved, or how they responded with guns before park officials could trank the poor tiger.